Aspen Timeline Calculations
Jan. 23rd, 2009 11:44 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
smallestopenerValdemaran timeline calculations
Okay! You asked for it, and here it is: what I've worked out for the timeline of Valdemaran events as they affect Vanyel Ashkevron and Ingress (er, and Megwyn, yes), based on canon and Millicanon both. Sources are cited in-text below as I reference them. I'd give you page numbers, but the odds are high your books wouldn't match my omnibus copy of the Last Herald-Mage trilogy, so.
Official Timeline for the Heralds of Valdemar Series
Taken from the timeline laid out in the authorized concordance, The Valdemar Companion, and updated from the same timeline as printed in the front of Exile's Valor.
* BF = Before the Founding
* AF = After the Founding
1000 BF: Prehistory: Era of the Black Gryphon
[The Mage Wars: The Black Gryphon, The White Gryphon, The Silver Gryphon]
Year Zero: Founding of Valdemar
750 AF: Reign of Elspeth the Peacemaker
[Story: "Sword of Ice"]
[The Last Herald-Mage: Magic's Pawn]
798 AF: Reign of Randale
[Stories: "Chance", "Blue Heart"]
[Filks: "Demonsbane," "Shadow Stalker," "Nightblades"]
[The Last Herald-Mage: Magic's Promise, Magic's Price]
1077 AF: Reign of Theran
[Brightly Burning]
1270 AF: Reign of Co-consorts Arden & Leesa
[Vows & Honor: Oathbound, Oathbreakers, Oathblood]
1315 AF: Reign of Roald
[No books set here; referenced later via Kerowyn's memories and tales of Tarma & Kethry that refer to Roald's histories]
1355 AF: Reign of Sendar
[Exile's Honor]
1376 AF: Reign of Selenay
[Exile's Valor, Take a Thief]
[Heralds of Valdemar: Arrows of the Queen, Arrow's Flight, Arrow's Fall]
[Kerowyn's Tale: By the Sword]
[The Mage Winds: Winds of Fate, Winds of Change, Winds of Fury]
[The Mage Storms: Storm Warning, Storm Rising, Storm Breaking]
[Owlflight, Owlsight, Owlknight]
The short story collections are scattered about. If need be, I can track them down and sort them in, but I think there are only a few that are of particular reference for our characters, and they're all in the collection Sword of Ice, as follows:
* "Chance," by Mark Shepherd: In which Vanyel meets Guardsman Jonne on the Karsite border. They have a very sweet, memorable encounter, and Vanyel is gifted with a rose-quartz crystal which he gives Savil as a focus-stone. Mentioned in chapter one & two of Magic's Promise and referred to as having happened "three years ago," which would have made Vanyel 25 at the time. (See below for detailed age calculations.)
* "Sword of Ice," by Mercedes Lackey and John Yezeguielian: In which Savil meets Starwind k'Treva and is made Wingsister, Set well before the events of Magic's Pawn.
* "In the Forest of Sorrows," by John Helfers: Just what the title says. Post-death encounter with Vanyel, Stefan, & Yfandes.
* "Blue Heart," by Philip M. Austin and Mercedes Lackey: Set in the reign of Selenay, it's the story of a mentally challenged but very sweet girl, Pilane, who was taken from her village near White Foal Pass and saved in a rather extraordinary way, i.e. by being turned into a blue butterfly. I mention this one simply because the villagers who tell the story mention a stranger who rode into their village and heard that Pilane had been kidnapped. He's described as "riding a tall, handsome white horse with strange, knowledge-filled blue eyes... garbed in pristine white, his face heartstoppingly handsome beneath silver-streaked hair. But most startling of all were his silver eyes..." Sounds like Vanyel Ashkevron to me, and at some point before he was fully silver-haired. Given that the village is near White Foal Pass, which we know from Brightly Burning was later renamed Burning Pines after Lavan Firestorm's spectacle at war with the Karsites-- this gives us a second reference for putting this story during Vanyel's time on the Karsite border.
* Filksongs that are applicable: "Demonsbane," "Shadow Stalker," and "Nightblades." We know from Savil's mentioning it in chapter two of Magic's Promise that Vanyel had the name "Demonsbane" at that point, so that song's fairly easy to set. I've placed the other two filks at the same timeframe, given that they both reference the Karsite border war as well.
Figuring out Vanyel's Age
We are told in chapter one of Magic's Promise that Vanyel is twenty-eight -- and at the time he remembers being "fifteen and in disgrace," when thinking of Withen. Later on, in chapter two when he's "whining" to Savil, he also refers to his bratty behavior at age fifteen, with every expectation that she'll know what he's talking about. Finally, we know from chapter four of Magic's Pawn that Tylendel is described as being "about sixteen," and later on in the same book that Vanyel is described as "the younger" of the two.
This makes Vanyel 15 during Magic's Pawn, and 28 during Magic's Promise.
As for Magic's Price: the easiest way to track Vanyel's age is through Jisa. In chapter one of Magic's Price, she's referred to as being "fifteen and the daughter of the king," and in chapter two of Magic's Promise she's mentioned as a "six-year-old." This gives us a nine-year difference.
And so, Vanyel is 15 during Magic's Pawn, 28 during Magic's Promise, and 37 during Magic's Price and at his death.
Pinning Down an Actual Place on the Timeline
798 AF is when Randale took the throne, and we know from chapter one of Magic's Promise that the truce with the Karsites that Elspeth Peacemaker had wrought fell apart when she died, "the moment poor Randale took the throne." We know from the same place that this is when Vanyel started pushing himself. Presuming he headed out to the Karsite border almost immediately, we know he was there for at least three years -- I'm basing that on the reference to Guardsman Jonne, plus references to "two years" of damage to his lute-case, plus Tantras's reference to Vanyel having spent "most of a year" substituting for five Heralds on the Karsite border. So. Call it three years. (Might be four, but I cannot for the life of me find the reference that makes me think this.)
That means that Magic's Promise begins in 801 AF. Given Vanyel is 28 at this point, and was 15 in Magic's Pawn, we have a difference of 13 years, which by simple subtraction sets Magic's Price in 788 AF, which gives us ten years to work with before it all goes to hell.
Using the same math and deriving from Vanyel's previously established age of 37 in Magic's Price, nine years after Magic's Promise -- that means that Magic's Price takes place in 810 AF.
Now. How does Ingress fit into this?
Ingress is seven currently, and Elspeth Peacemaker is alive. I believe, in the fic I've written (er, almost completely), I set Vanyel as being 21 when Ingress visited Valdemar the first time-- which makes the year 794, and four years before Elspeth Peacemaker's death.
This means that Ingress will be seventeen and likely ready for her internship circuit in 804 -- after the events of the Lineas-Baires disaster outlined in Magic's Promise and as things begin to get dicey, but enough before Vanyel's death that she can be well-established by the time that the events of Magic's Price take place. Ingress will be 23 when Vanyel dies, and well able to begin diplomatic work as an Opener Herald-- long before the events of Vanyel's spell from Sorrows to remove the memory of mages kick in about 60 - 70 years later, soon after Stefen's death. And, as her Gift is established as analogous to Fetching, she won't be a target for Leareth's tricks during the timeframe of Magic's Price.
Whew. I think that's it. Comments, questions, analysis? Did I miss anything?
ETA: I knew I forgot something. Re: timeframe for Ingress and how it affects where Vanyel is in time at present -- I don't know, Rym, how/when you were looking to bring him in from, but since Ingress's presence in Valdemar can be easily linked to Megwyn's back-and-forth, and time is tricksy in London Below to begin with, we can slot her "return" to Valdemar for training where it needs to be in terms of the actual year without interfering at all with how you want to handle things for Vanyel. She'll only be making occasional visits until she returns for training, so this applies all the way up through the events of Magic's Promise, if we presume that she comes to start her Heraldic training at about age 15, in 802 AF. If you are planning to run him through Magic's Price and then bring him in dead from Sorrows afterwards, that will take a bit more tweaking but should be workable-- I have a couple of theories on how it could be handled, so.
Okay! You asked for it, and here it is: what I've worked out for the timeline of Valdemaran events as they affect Vanyel Ashkevron and Ingress (er, and Megwyn, yes), based on canon and Millicanon both. Sources are cited in-text below as I reference them. I'd give you page numbers, but the odds are high your books wouldn't match my omnibus copy of the Last Herald-Mage trilogy, so.
Official Timeline for the Heralds of Valdemar Series
Taken from the timeline laid out in the authorized concordance, The Valdemar Companion, and updated from the same timeline as printed in the front of Exile's Valor.
* BF = Before the Founding
* AF = After the Founding
1000 BF: Prehistory: Era of the Black Gryphon
[The Mage Wars: The Black Gryphon, The White Gryphon, The Silver Gryphon]
Year Zero: Founding of Valdemar
750 AF: Reign of Elspeth the Peacemaker
[Story: "Sword of Ice"]
[The Last Herald-Mage: Magic's Pawn]
798 AF: Reign of Randale
[Stories: "Chance", "Blue Heart"]
[Filks: "Demonsbane," "Shadow Stalker," "Nightblades"]
[The Last Herald-Mage: Magic's Promise, Magic's Price]
1077 AF: Reign of Theran
[Brightly Burning]
1270 AF: Reign of Co-consorts Arden & Leesa
[Vows & Honor: Oathbound, Oathbreakers, Oathblood]
1315 AF: Reign of Roald
[No books set here; referenced later via Kerowyn's memories and tales of Tarma & Kethry that refer to Roald's histories]
1355 AF: Reign of Sendar
[Exile's Honor]
1376 AF: Reign of Selenay
[Exile's Valor, Take a Thief]
[Heralds of Valdemar: Arrows of the Queen, Arrow's Flight, Arrow's Fall]
[Kerowyn's Tale: By the Sword]
[The Mage Winds: Winds of Fate, Winds of Change, Winds of Fury]
[The Mage Storms: Storm Warning, Storm Rising, Storm Breaking]
[Owlflight, Owlsight, Owlknight]
The short story collections are scattered about. If need be, I can track them down and sort them in, but I think there are only a few that are of particular reference for our characters, and they're all in the collection Sword of Ice, as follows:
* "Chance," by Mark Shepherd: In which Vanyel meets Guardsman Jonne on the Karsite border. They have a very sweet, memorable encounter, and Vanyel is gifted with a rose-quartz crystal which he gives Savil as a focus-stone. Mentioned in chapter one & two of Magic's Promise and referred to as having happened "three years ago," which would have made Vanyel 25 at the time. (See below for detailed age calculations.)
* "Sword of Ice," by Mercedes Lackey and John Yezeguielian: In which Savil meets Starwind k'Treva and is made Wingsister, Set well before the events of Magic's Pawn.
* "In the Forest of Sorrows," by John Helfers: Just what the title says. Post-death encounter with Vanyel, Stefan, & Yfandes.
* "Blue Heart," by Philip M. Austin and Mercedes Lackey: Set in the reign of Selenay, it's the story of a mentally challenged but very sweet girl, Pilane, who was taken from her village near White Foal Pass and saved in a rather extraordinary way, i.e. by being turned into a blue butterfly. I mention this one simply because the villagers who tell the story mention a stranger who rode into their village and heard that Pilane had been kidnapped. He's described as "riding a tall, handsome white horse with strange, knowledge-filled blue eyes... garbed in pristine white, his face heartstoppingly handsome beneath silver-streaked hair. But most startling of all were his silver eyes..." Sounds like Vanyel Ashkevron to me, and at some point before he was fully silver-haired. Given that the village is near White Foal Pass, which we know from Brightly Burning was later renamed Burning Pines after Lavan Firestorm's spectacle at war with the Karsites-- this gives us a second reference for putting this story during Vanyel's time on the Karsite border.
* Filksongs that are applicable: "Demonsbane," "Shadow Stalker," and "Nightblades." We know from Savil's mentioning it in chapter two of Magic's Promise that Vanyel had the name "Demonsbane" at that point, so that song's fairly easy to set. I've placed the other two filks at the same timeframe, given that they both reference the Karsite border war as well.
Figuring out Vanyel's Age
We are told in chapter one of Magic's Promise that Vanyel is twenty-eight -- and at the time he remembers being "fifteen and in disgrace," when thinking of Withen. Later on, in chapter two when he's "whining" to Savil, he also refers to his bratty behavior at age fifteen, with every expectation that she'll know what he's talking about. Finally, we know from chapter four of Magic's Pawn that Tylendel is described as being "about sixteen," and later on in the same book that Vanyel is described as "the younger" of the two.
This makes Vanyel 15 during Magic's Pawn, and 28 during Magic's Promise.
As for Magic's Price: the easiest way to track Vanyel's age is through Jisa. In chapter one of Magic's Price, she's referred to as being "fifteen and the daughter of the king," and in chapter two of Magic's Promise she's mentioned as a "six-year-old." This gives us a nine-year difference.
And so, Vanyel is 15 during Magic's Pawn, 28 during Magic's Promise, and 37 during Magic's Price and at his death.
Pinning Down an Actual Place on the Timeline
798 AF is when Randale took the throne, and we know from chapter one of Magic's Promise that the truce with the Karsites that Elspeth Peacemaker had wrought fell apart when she died, "the moment poor Randale took the throne." We know from the same place that this is when Vanyel started pushing himself. Presuming he headed out to the Karsite border almost immediately, we know he was there for at least three years -- I'm basing that on the reference to Guardsman Jonne, plus references to "two years" of damage to his lute-case, plus Tantras's reference to Vanyel having spent "most of a year" substituting for five Heralds on the Karsite border. So. Call it three years. (Might be four, but I cannot for the life of me find the reference that makes me think this.)
That means that Magic's Promise begins in 801 AF. Given Vanyel is 28 at this point, and was 15 in Magic's Pawn, we have a difference of 13 years, which by simple subtraction sets Magic's Price in 788 AF, which gives us ten years to work with before it all goes to hell.
Using the same math and deriving from Vanyel's previously established age of 37 in Magic's Price, nine years after Magic's Promise -- that means that Magic's Price takes place in 810 AF.
Now. How does Ingress fit into this?
Ingress is seven currently, and Elspeth Peacemaker is alive. I believe, in the fic I've written (er, almost completely), I set Vanyel as being 21 when Ingress visited Valdemar the first time-- which makes the year 794, and four years before Elspeth Peacemaker's death.
This means that Ingress will be seventeen and likely ready for her internship circuit in 804 -- after the events of the Lineas-Baires disaster outlined in Magic's Promise and as things begin to get dicey, but enough before Vanyel's death that she can be well-established by the time that the events of Magic's Price take place. Ingress will be 23 when Vanyel dies, and well able to begin diplomatic work as an Opener Herald-- long before the events of Vanyel's spell from Sorrows to remove the memory of mages kick in about 60 - 70 years later, soon after Stefen's death. And, as her Gift is established as analogous to Fetching, she won't be a target for Leareth's tricks during the timeframe of Magic's Price.
Whew. I think that's it. Comments, questions, analysis? Did I miss anything?
ETA: I knew I forgot something. Re: timeframe for Ingress and how it affects where Vanyel is in time at present -- I don't know, Rym, how/when you were looking to bring him in from, but since Ingress's presence in Valdemar can be easily linked to Megwyn's back-and-forth, and time is tricksy in London Below to begin with, we can slot her "return" to Valdemar for training where it needs to be in terms of the actual year without interfering at all with how you want to handle things for Vanyel. She'll only be making occasional visits until she returns for training, so this applies all the way up through the events of Magic's Promise, if we presume that she comes to start her Heraldic training at about age 15, in 802 AF. If you are planning to run him through Magic's Price and then bring him in dead from Sorrows afterwards, that will take a bit more tweaking but should be workable-- I have a couple of theories on how it could be handled, so.
